Headteacher Shares Game-Changing Impact of Coaching in Schools

Kate:

I’m Kate Cliffe. I’m the Head at Carrington Infant School, which is an infant school in Buckinghamshire.

Annie:

Brilliant. Thanks very much. And what experience of coaching did you have before you trained with us?

Kate:

Well, I had the whole coaching, mentoring – Which is coaching? Which is mentoring? I remember doing a course like years and years ago in a school that I taught in. And it was very brief. It was a kind of conversation around coaching, mentoring. I don’t think anybody really came away knowing what the difference was between the two. So, definitely aware of the whole world of it, but certainly not anywhere framed like it is with ‘Coachinginschools’.

Annie:

That’s great. Thanks. And what reservations did you have before buying into our training?

Kate:

I didn’t, I had no reservations because I read the book beforehand. We’d connected on LinkedIn. Yeah. And because we’d had the conversations with other Headteachers – because I was part of that group with the Headteachers talking, solution-focused. So I didn’t really have any reservations. It was more about convincing my business managers to spend the money. <Laugh> But that, and that was easy. So that was okay.

Annie:

That’s fantastic. So, what made you finally decide to get involved then?

Kate:

Well I’m new, new into this school, so I came here as a Head in, just in the second bit of the pandemic in 2019. And new Head, and new school, the opportunity to put your own stamp on it. And just conversations with people about how problems came to the doors of senior leadership. And I didn’t really want to have that culture in the school, so looking for a way to not have that culture, and it fitted with that. And just wanting to really have it as, you know, what I do here, you know, this is my school, and having, you know, just creating a different direction for the school.

Annie:

That’s brilliant. So how do you feel it’s made your job and your life easier, Kate?

Kate:

It’s made it easier because, well first of all I’ve got myself the business manager, my two, my Assistant Head, and my Deputy – she’s now left, but then my new Assistant Head will be doing the training for being a coach after Easter. And it’s just that clarity of thought, that understanding that the job can be a job, task can be completed when it’s broken down into its constituent parts and enabling you to have the space and time to think about that sort of thing. The coaching programme enables you to have that, and have a pace that is manageable, I suppose, so that less panic and more calm.

Annie:

And that’s so important in today’s world, isn’t it? You know, people are just feeling overwhelmed all the time.

Kate:

Yeah…I think that’s the one conversation that Headteachers say all the time – about being overwhelmed, and, you know, or teachers. It’s the constant conversation. So anything that we can do to, help that is, you know, brilliant!

Annie:

That’s fantastic. Thank you. So just thinking about the impact of your coaching that you did on another member of staff using the ‘Coachinginschools’ system. So just talk me through, you know, what the person was like before you began using it, what they’re like now, and then we’ll think about, you know, what the outcome would’ve been if you hadn’t coached them.

Kate:

Okay. So I coached, I’ve coached two people, but the person I’m going to talk about is the maths lead in school. Okay. And she works three days a week, so she’s part-time. She’s a busy mum of two. And she has been in school for a while – a long time before me – and she’s very established in school. She’s, um, but she does everything at the same time, with little – not little – but frustrating levels of success to get through the task. So we had a school improvement partner come in to do some deep dives and she wanted preparation for that deep dive. And so we used the coaching to support her preparation for it. And she was just delighted with the whole process. She still talks about it. So we just went through…The bit that she found really challenging is the um easy to number the barriers.

Kate:

Yeah. Really easy! – Most of them are children, child-related. But being able to put time aside and recognise that she had to put time aside and to communicate that time aside to a partner or to job share or whatever it is to get that particular task done. And she was just so pleased with how efficient she was with the time because of that sense of accountability and having to feedback to me, when you’re going to do a particular aspect of your task or mini goal, she was able to feel that sense of achievement, moving on. And she was very invested in the process and now she talked about it just the other day. She said, oh, since I’ve done that coaching, I get that task done, I think about what I need to do and I then do it. And she said I was so efficient the other day in school, I just got all these jobs done and, and she links it back to the coaching. So it’s interesting how she’s kind of internalised it.

Annie:

That’s brilliant, isn’t it? Because that shows you haven’t just made an impact by doing that block of six sessions with her in the coaching cycle, but she’s actually continuing to use it herself. So well done. You.

Kate:

Yeah, thanks. I’m really pleased with how she’s, you know, she’s taken it on because then she talks about it with other people and so then it’s just this, you know, it’s just part of what we do. So, yeah, it was really, she was a really good one to coach.

Annie:

Yeah. And that’s also important with you cause obviously you’re trying to establish a coaching culture in the school, aren’t you? Yeah. So that’s going to help with that, you know, that sort of gradual ripple effect, you know, other people talking about it, it’s not just the Head leading it, you know?

Kate:

Absolutely not. People talking. Yeah. And making sure that, you know, it’s a, it’s an infant school, so it’s a smallish school, so having, you know, it’ll always have an impact or whoever it is that’s doing the coaching. So yeah, I was, yeah, it’s good who’s done it so far. Yeah.

Annie:

That’s great. What do you think would’ve happened if you hadn’t coached her?

Kate:

She wouldn’t have had the clarity of completing the task, I’d imagine. Yeah. And it wouldn’t have, she would’ve done it eventually, but it’s that sense of, well you’re just giving yourself the time to do it. So, and I think it allows me to be a more, um, she knew that she was accountable.

Kate:

So she knew I was expecting stuff. Yeah. so that has an extra kind of psychological effect on you doing that task, isn’t it, to make sure that you get it in. So, yeah. I think it would not have, would’ve been done, but maybe not so efficiently.

Annie:

That’s brilliant. And that accountability, like you say, people actually like that, don’t they? Yeah, It’s so important to them. Yeah, they do. You Know

Kate:

Yeah. You like a boundary <laugh>. Yeah.

Annie:

Always!

Kate:

Kids like a boundary and staff do within, you know, deadlines. Yeah.

Annie:

That’s fantastic. Well, obviously you’ve made some really good impact there. So we’ve trained several of your staff as coaches. Like you said, there’s another one coming on board after Easter. So how would you say our coaching systems helping you and SLT to drive the school forward, Kate?

Kate:

Oh, it’s, it’s brilliant. So it’s the, so if I talk about one of the people who was very reticent to do the coaching to start with, couldn’t see, like, the purpose

Annie:

Love those!

Kate:

Couldn’t see the purpose of it and all seemed a bit woowoo and bohemian and why, you know, so, but now this person is really invested in it and really sees the value of questioning to elicit the information that you want out of it. So for me, from a Head that moves it forward because you, there’s less faff. Yeah. And there’s more direction and my Assistant Head, Anna, who’s nearly finishing the coaching, she is coaching, at the moment, a teacher who’s new into the school, she’s a reception teacher. And just finding her way and being able to just give her that confidence to move forward means that I know that that’s happening and it’s going to happen. Yeah. Because the coach, the coaching model will allow it to happen. So I suppose it’s that element of relaxation you can have, like you’ve delegated the task and if it’s done in a coaching way, it’s going to be…you’re going to have that sense of completion over it, it’s going to be completed.

Kate:

So yeah, it, it’s an exciting proposition and I had to, you know, I think it does just what we need to do now is just identify who is going to be our next sort of coaching group. Yeah, and move again forward. I had an appraisal session with staff yesterday and one of my teachers, I was talking to her about the coaching, she sent me an email, said, “That sounds amazing! Can I be coached please?” You know, and so she – Wow. You know, so she was, you know, so I think it’s just slowly, slowly we’ll just push things through, just makes sure that projects happen and have completion.

Annie:

Yeah, definitely. Definitely. And once you’ve done that next bit of the training as well, that’s gonna really help you that. So yeah, just gradually get the ripple effect taking over the school.

Kate:

Slowly. Slowly.

Annie:

So how does the impact compare with what you’d originally hoped for?

Kate:

I suppose you don’t, before you do it, you don’t really appreciate that you can identify something in the school development plan and you hope, you know, and you put things in place so things can get completed. Yeah. But I think it allowed, it gives me a much closer focus on what needs to be done and then if you’re giving it to those certain people to coach people to get that task done, it just makes sure that it’s going to happen. So I suppose for me it’s like, yeah, I hope that this would happen and then by doing the coaching yes, it does have that momentum and that movement forward for a school development strategic position. I don’t know if I answered the question, but…

Annie:

You, you did answer the question, because you’re talking obviously about, you know, that impact compared with what you originally hoped for there. So yeah, that’s, that’s great because, you know, it is showing us that these things happen that you don’t even know are going to happen a lot of the time. You know, when you’re signing up for something, it’s almost, you get these kind of added benefits, don’t you?

Kate:

And I think it’s because it’s about practising all the time. Yeah. And it’s not just like you do it, you do your training, you know. So many training we go on and we just do it, and then you move on, and then there’s another initiative that comes along. But because that’s, there’s that sort of also buy-in and expectation that you’re going to be practising it and talking about it. And so, you know, I even just having conversations with the school business manager and we’ll just say, oh my God, there’s a bit of coaching in there. You know, just things like that. Well that was a laser question steady, you know, just things like that, which is nice. Yeah. Because it just means that it’s always bubbling and then it starts just to feel natural. So it’s, it’s good. Yeah.

Annie:

That’s great. And I think that’s really important and that’s one of the reasons why we build those practical tasks into the, into the training obviously, because you know, you don’t want to know the theory, you want to be able to live it, breathe it, do it in your…

Kate:

Yeah, definitely

Annie:

…In those everyday interactions, don’t you?

Kate:

Yeah, absolutely. And I’ve got, somebody I know, well, somebody in school today is having a quite a difficult conversation with somebody. And we talked yesterday about the process and how to do that and you know, I was saying, you know, these open questions and then just don’t speak and it’s uncomfortable, but get, get that information from them without you having to give it to them. So it’s sort of coming in in lots of different ways now, which is good.

Annie:

That’s fantastic. So, what would you say to another Head about value for money, Kate?

Kate:

Oh yeah. Well, it’s, it goes everywhere. So it’s not just about you doing it. So one, if a Head goes on a course and they come back with that information and they might be able to spread it out amongst people. But because you are the value of money is that the value of it is that you are training, I’ve trained lots of people, well, four people at the same time. So then that has impact and spreads through everything. So it’s def… I mean I’ve recommended this to my sister and another Headteacher. So, you know, I think that’s testament that, and I think they’ve, I think they’re going forward with it. Well certainly one is. So I think that’s testament to the value for money that it is.

Annie:

Oh, that’s fantastic. Thank you so much. So, what was it actually like for you learning to coach via the online programme?

Kate:

The online programme is fine. It’s just me and being able to, negotiate being a new Head in a new school with Covid going on, it was really difficult for me to just put my mind to that, that we had a really tricky cohort. So, there was a lot going on and so the interface was absolutely fine. It’s just my ability to be able to actually not get caught up in all the other stuff so that I was able to do it. So, but once I had a strong word from you Annie, on we went

Annie:

Yeah, that supportive kick up the bum!

Kate:

And that’s also part of the value for money, isn’t it? That you’re not just doing the training, you’re doing the conversations and the reassurance and the support. Yeah. That goes along with it. It’s not just a, you follow a programme on the computer – and then you’re done. Yeah. It’s this as well, the in-person face-to-face conversations, which is part of it. So,

Annie:

Yeah. It’s funny actually, because a lot of people don’t realise that they get all of that kind of support alongside it and obviously, you know, it’s just a case of helping you to fit it into your everyday stuff, isn’t it? And then when you did that, obviously you were, you were flying with it and got through it.

Kate:

Yeah, absolutely, yeah, and also the, the value of you being at the end of the phone or the, and the realisation, what I like is that your emails always pop up with, I can’t answer, I might not be able to answer it today, but, and that just also puts layers of understanding in your head about the process, about managing time and, so yeah, it’s all part of it.

Annie:

Ah,

Kate:

That’s subliminal messaging Annie. That’s what it is.

Annie:

We love all that,

Kate:

You’re the ‘Derren Brown’ of coaching!

Annie:

That’s it. That’s it. But I mean the, the support is the important thing and helping you Yeah. You know, with, with that, that strategic stuff. And I know a lot of the time people say that’s something that’s, that’s different about us because very often they’ll buy into some training – and then they’re just on their own with it, you know, they don’t get that.

Kate:

You feel like it’s a journey with… Yeah… In the… you’ve got somebody going on the journey with you properly. Yeah. So yeah, I think that’s, a really important aspect of it.

Annie:

That’s brilliant. Thanks. So, what would you say to someone who’s thinking of doing the ‘Coachinginschools’ training?

Kate:

Read the book!

Annie:

Yeah.

Kate:

And then the book is written in such a way that you have to do the training because, you want to know what those 12 steps are. <laugh>. Yeah read the book, go on the website and you can see the testimonials. And you can watch actually some of these things. So yeah, just speak to people who’ve done it potentially and just do it because it won’t be a wrong thing. It simply won’t be a wrong thing as long as you’re invested in the culture of it and you see it as a whole school movement. Then that’s the right, I believe the right ethos to have.

Annie:

Totally agree. It’s about developing that coaching culture, isn’t it? That’s why we are not interested in, in just training individuals because, you know, an individual’s capacity is just so limited and if the Head’s not driving it and behind it and it’s not going to become part of the school. Yeah. It would just be a waste of money for somebody. You know, it’s not about a box ticking or something for the CV, it’s about actually changing the way people work on

Kate:

Yeah. I’m very lucky. Well, because one of my governors is a coach in her job in the university world, and she really understands the value of it. So I didn’t have to sell it to my governors – she did that for me. So, you know, the investment is from, from everyone as well, sort of financially as well as, you know, emotionally they’re invested so

Annie:

Ah. That’s, that’s brilliant. So obviously you just mentioned that, that she’s a coach. I know you’ve mentioned previously that you’d done some sort of bits on, on courses and things. So how would you say our coaching system is different to the coaching that people learn on, on courses Kate?

Kate:

First of all, you very clearly explain the difference between coaching and mentoring. I think that’s the, like the foundation to it. And then, yeah. I haven’t used the word mentoring since I started this programme.

Kate:

Interesting. So it is about coaching, so, and it’s, there’s just a depth to it. And because you unpick the cognitive processes as well that go on with people when they’re listening or when they’re, mirroring body language or, you know, all of that, that it, so it’s the whole package rather than just conversation. Yeah. That doesn’t really have a structure. So it’s the structured nature of it, the understanding how people work, and then it teaches you about yourself as well. So I… I know that one of the units was about reflecting on your own ability to just shut up and listen and, you know, that is the, that is hard to do. And other courses, courses don’t, that I’ve been on, it’s not about that, it’s just, it’s about mentoring, it’s not about, it’s about giving answers as opposed to the person coming up with them themselves. So it, it’s a totally… it’s a model that just explores it in different ways, rather than just a conversation.

Annie:

Yeah. And what difference does that make for you in terms of learning to coach?

Kate:

Well, for me personally, I, I don’t want to do things in school that aren’t research based. So the fact that it enables me to confidently talk to my staff and governors about a research based programme that will enable us to, you know, be empowered. And socially focused, for me, that is the most important thing. I don’t know if that answers your question. I can’t actually remember the question now. I feel like I’m in an interview for a job.

Annie:

Don’t worry, don’t worry. No, you did, you did answer the question, Kate. So don’t, don’t worry about that at all. So finally, if you could sum up the, the coaching programme – the ‘Coachinginschools’ programme – in three words, what would they be?

Kate:

Three words. This is like a coaching question. Valuable.

Annie:

Mm-hmm. <affirmative>,

Kate:

Empowering, and… Momentum.

Annie:

Nice. That’s brilliant. Thank you so much. Kate. Is there anything that you’d like to add that I haven’t asked you at all?

Kate:

I don’t think so.

Annie:

That’s brilliant. Well, listen, thank you so much for your time. I really…

Kate:

Thank you, Annie.

Annie:

…Really appreciate it.

Kate:

Oh, thank you. It’s great. I’ll speak to you soon, Annie.